Tuesday, March 26, 2013

The Respect Dare Day 12: Leftovers


This study today made me think about how some things turn into "all about me" type of thinking.  There have been times where I've asked Randy to do something and came back another day to find out it wasn't done.  Well, I'm just as guilty at this and sometimes things happen like we are tired at the time, or we say we will do it later and then forget.  Its our reaction after that that is either Godly or negative in our perspective of things.  

I"m going to start looking at how I'm perceiving things.  Do I really know for a fact that Randy didn't do something because he just didn't want to or forgot?  Maybe he was tired or his hips were hurting. Until I know 100% I shouldn't assume he was lazy or just didn't want to help me.  That is a great task to conquer to improve my relationship with Randy and with anyone I come into contact.  

I also realized sometimes an insult or injury is just actions due to being tired on the part of the other person.  So for today and each day I am choosing to be kind in words no matter how tired I am. I will remember the quote "if you cant say anything nice, don't say anything at all".  Im going to need to just pause no matter how much I want to blurt out the first thing that comes to mind and just see the truth of the matter before assuming.

I am so proud I wanted to really speak my mind when I had to take care of Peyton for what felt like the umpteenth time without Randy's help while he watched tv, and I kept my thoughts to myself.  I know his hips are hurting so I'm trying to do more even though I'm working the full time job and having to take peyton to and from daycare without help.  Its been rough but I'm getting it done.  


Monday, March 25, 2013

Respect Dare Day 11: Whatever we pay attention to grows!

I'll be honest, I was up a few times with the little one so my mind had to process this all day long as I really wanted to dive into this one as much as I could.  This rings so true.  If we spend time on the computer or watch TV, it robs our time.  If we watch shows that are not worthy of watching in God's eyes, we start to live that way by becoming numb to the immorality and language, and filth that we watch on TV.  We must watch what we occupy our time with so that we don't become part of the world but only in the world until we finally go to our final home.  I'm guilty of this as much as the next person.  I noticed I was playing way too much on facebook games and it was taking time away from my kids and my husband.  I've noticed Randy was spending time watching TV.  With both of us doing separate things in separate rooms, that was time away from each other.  That is not how I wanted my marriage to be.

How did I change this?  By stepping away from the computer and just sitting in the chair in the living room where Randy sits to watch TV. I want to spend time even if it means watching some pretty boring shows (in my mind they are definitely not shows I watch) but it also means I'm with him.  We both are trying to be better about our time management watching TV and being on the computer.  Now I pretty much am on to blog and really don't spend more than an hour.  

This kind of brings me to the topic of today's dare.  Basically, too often we pay attention to the negatives in a situation instead of focusing on a positive to have a positive outcome. For example, instead of nagging Randy about all the TV watching he does every evening, I just close my laptop and go sit near him.  Like in the verse above, if our thoughts are constantly on those listed in that verse, we will start to look at life through the lens of the Holy Spirit.  God deserves the credit for everything good. 

My goal is to see my negatives as my cue to seek God's perspective instead of turning it towards someone.  By doing this I will sin less and live the way He is wanting me to.  I will be drawn closer to Him, which is ultimately my goal :-)

As for today, it was rough in the evening.  Peyton was so excited to be home I had put her down and she ran towards her daddy who was sitting at the table.  She tripped and hit the corner of the leg of the table and now has a very huge bruise on her forehead.  I did take her to the pediatrician to make sure she was alright as she was very upset and then became tired.  What a distraction lol.



Sunday, March 24, 2013

The Respect Dare Day 10: Good Advice

I just realized I am 1/4 of the way through the study and I'm really starting to love this.  I feel in a better place with my husband and with God because of this study and opening up etc,.  I have been really praying lately as I just dont feel like God is with me and I know thats not true.  I'm just so overly tired and discouraged, but this person refuses to give in or give up.

What a verse. I had to read it over and over to have it really sink in but it sure does ring true.  Listening more than speaking or giving advice seems to be the subject of a lot of these study days.  Maybe we should start listening more and not speaking right away so that we can "chew" on the subject and be able to respond in a more positive way.

I hope I'm not the type to judge as I know i used to be but life has shown me that its not fun to live as a person being judged.  I also do not like seeing someone I know judge another person.  It hurts to know I know someone of this stature and that is where I refuse to become like this person.  I want others to see me has non judgement and kind.  Not a doormat, but someone that is compassionate towards anyone.  

I am pretty good at talking with Randy in this aspect.  We feel safe talking to each other and non judgemental, well...better now that when we were a year ago.  I do notice, though, that I need to work on this with my boys though.  I'm so passionate about some things that when they act out, I just "loose my cool" instead of listening to what they are saying.  Maybe they are reaching out and I'm thinking they are being disrespectful.  I want my boys to grow up respecting their wives so I want to be a better role model.

This lesson was easy but was also hard.  Its more difficult every day as I know Satan would love for me to give up and become my old self again.  I also know he has been attacking our family lately and it is so hard to slow down and realize it is Satan.  I'll just continue to pray for the knowledge to know the difference and for God to guide me through this journey.

Saturday, March 23, 2013

The Respect Dare Day 9: Project Overlook


Its so easy to get all worked up and angry and the first instinct is to respond back in self defense.  After today's reading I realized you don't have to respond back in "self defense", but think faster than responding.  As I've heard the saying "pick your battles", it sure is ringing true lately.  I'm also noticing I'm slowly responding to what I feel are little "fights" brewing.  How one person perceives the way something is said may not be the way I perceive that.  Its so hard to distinguish how someone really is saying something.  

I after a lot of research on Gods view of anger, I love how he allows us to become angry, but also how he instructs us to handle that anger.  Sure, we all get angry, its how we take that anger to the next level is when we sin.  

I have learned just because my husband may forget something that is important to me or says something that hurts my feelings, I'm going to look at it in a different view instead of showing anger.  He may not have intentionally said something to hurt me and I know we all forget things from time to time, that in these moments I need to extend the same grace to my husband that God has extended to me.  

On a different topic, we decided to take our youngest's paci away and it has been a challenging day.  This topic actually fit since when all you hear is crying because she is frustrated and doesn't know how to soothe herself without a paci you want to react back.  She's hanging in there and so are we.  We will get through this.


Friday, March 22, 2013

Respect Dare Day 8: Remember


Well woke up and realizing I'm still fighting a head cold and Peyton didn't sleep since she was up coughing all night. This cold and flu season has really knocked us down.  Its tiring just thinking about it.  I know there is a reason we are constantly sick but dang, this is ridiculous!!

This was an eye opener day.  I actually really liked it as I brought Randy into the study when I was to share with him a few things.  I was asked to list five positive attributes or strengths that were the reasons enough for me to marry Randy.  I was to list these and think back to when I was engaged and the first months of our marriage.  This was so easy to do.  I love looking back to when we were dating and when we were newly married and getting to know each other on an entirely new level.

The next question was "Why was each one important to you at the time?"  This was easy to answer as I could give an example during that time of why I chose each strength/attribute on the reason I married him.  This next one was the one that really opened my eyes.  "Ask God to show you examples of how your husband still possesses these strengths.  What are you sensing right now?"  It almost was sad to feel that I had not seen the fact he still has these within him. The busyness of life had really clouded the truth of how things really were.  I really thoroughly enjoyed going back and thinking about the things that I love about Randy, and even more enjoyed realizing that he still had these strengths/attributes.  It was I that wasn't seeing them and looking for all the wrong things.  

A challenge the dare asked of me was to tell my husband what I wrote down and why.  A few years ago I would've said no way am I sharing such a deep personal reflection, but today I really loved it.  I felt so close to him being about to trust him with my thoughts and my answers.  He actually really opened up and appreciated me doing this.  I love how this is bringing us closer together in such a Godly way.  I am going to try to remember, he is still the person that has all those qualities that I fell in love with.  

This is something that really is worth reading and re reading:

"Bottom Line:  Wisdom comes from seeing the truth in the big picture and not allowing your perceptions to be clouded by life's daily challenges."

What a great way to see things :-)  I'm definitely going to be back for day 9 

Thursday, March 21, 2013

Respect Dare Day 7: If You Cant Say Something Nice....


Kind of ironic, the title of this Dare, if you cant say something nice.....  My mother used to tell me and my siblings this until it sunk in.  Then when friends of ours would come over and were rude in any way, she would tell them that saying also.  Kind of made me smile when I saw those words.

Unfortunately those words needed to stay with me all day as I really did not have a great attitude. I would just log into my pictures and see this verse there.  I want so much to hear God and do what his will is.  Just need to feel Him with me I guess and right now I'm not :-( but will still continue on with this study as it is doing my soul some good.

This study was really good and it gave me a great outlook on how to positively talk about my spouse (even though I had been anyways, it did reinforce the reason why).  The example was three girlfriends getting together for coffee and chatting.  Two of them were chatting badly about their husbands while the other one realized her relationship with these girls had changed since she had learned to be positive about her husband even though he was not present.  So much can affect the way people perceive your spouse by not presenting them in a positive way.  Even if you are venting, think before you speak.  

Some of the questions were difficult as one in specific asked "Are you feeling brave?  Ask your husband if he ever feels diminished by you and the way you communicate with him.  Write out what you asked and how he responded.  Or if you choose to stay blind in this area, explain why."  I definitely wanted to change within and how would I if I didn't open up to see how HE sees and hears me communicating with  him.  I did ask and I will say, it wasn't all positive and it wasn't all negative.  I have some more work in this area but he said he saw me trying and the start of changes in me.  At least it made me feel glad he saw the positive changes happening.  It didn't happen overnight to get where I am, it wont happen overnight to change.

My personal goal that wasn't in the book for myself is to communicate respect by speaking words that will encourage him instead of communicating with him or about him in a way that diminishes him.  I have also realized this doesn't only pertain to my husband, I should be communicating with others around me with respect and not in a diminishing way.

Wednesday, March 20, 2013

Respect Dare Day 6....part 2


I'm just so broken this morning.  Life is too busy and I feel it tugging me in so many directions.  I'm not used to having my days filled with meetings till late at night, kids sports, etc and it seems Satan is really working on my.  I feel so discouraged this morning and was not in a good place to be handling Peyton.  I snapped at her when she was throwing one of her fits and well... Randy came down and took her into another room and that is when I started crying. I feel so inadequate and overwhelmed as a parent.  I feel like the world is on my shoulders and I really just need lots of prayers.

I'm feeling pretty low this morning and I know Satan is playing a roll in all this and I'm fighting back. Guess he doesn't like the fact I'm spending way more time in God's word and working on improving myself and my marriage/family.  

On dare day 6, it asked me what one act of kindness or chore can I do for my husband today.  Well, I knew he had to get a hair cut right before Collin had baseball practice so I was planning on taking Collin without my husband having to worry about rushing or having to take him to practice.  How will my expectation (regarding my husband's response) be challenged when doing this?  It really wasn't after I kept reading Philippians 2:14.  I really need to do things without complaining or expecting a response.  I'm learning to do it cheerfully and just because, not for recognition.  

A couple of questions that really stood out to me was "Do you tend to state the facts, or do you communicate emotionally? What would be the outcome if you could communicate more factually in your relationship with your husband?"  Well this would open up a entirely whole new way of communicating between us, and in a good way.  I'm a very passionate person which in turn turns into emotional communication.  I'm slowly learning to just think about things first then replying or stating things in a factual way.  Its been nice when I tried this today as usually when we communicate it ends up being emotional and we disagree or really misunderstand each other.  I really think Randy would enjoy talking with me more if I was more of a non emotional communicator.  I think that would be such a wonderful thing in our marriage.  

I think these two days I've learned to do things for my husband through love and without the expectation or resentment that usually had shown itself.  I have also learned to really slow down and listen before speaking as it has really helped in getting a point across as I'm stating it factually instead of emotionally.  

I'm actually starting to look forward to Day 7 of this dare :-)  Till then.....







Tuesday, March 19, 2013

Respect Dare Day 6: Random Acts


For some this is really easy especially if they are recognized for it.  For others, its difficult as its easy to want the recognition for the act of kindness.  There have been times when I have done something nice for Randy an was really disappointed when he didn't say anything.  I let the "stinking thinking" take over and cloud my thought process and let myself become disappointed and angry over something so small and totally not worthy of my emotion. I now see it for what its worth and that I should WANT to do these things for my husband without recognition.  I have in the past, but sometimes it hits me  when Satan is at work that I want him to say something to me like "thanks for doing that for me".  It goes both ways but he has never shown me any disappointment for not recognizing anything he's done for me. 

Isn't it Christ like to do things without being recognized?  I mean, Jesus washed his disciples' feet before anyone did his.  My gosh, this is the son of God serving others.  He didn't boast or say, "Look, I'm doing this for you. You need to recognize me and make it a big deal".  He did it humbly and without expectations.  What a great teacher He was.  He was teaching us to serve others without that expectation is how I am looking at it. We are supposed to have a joyful heart.  

The dare for today may run into a couple days as life is busy with work and a very long late meeting (till 9 pm) and I wont be home till late.  I'm not skipping or moving past this day's study until I've accomplished it, so please expect it to run through two days.  I would rather not rush and not learn anything.  Today it asked me "What one act of kindness or chore can you do for your husband today?"  This is the reason I am not going to rush this as I really want to ponder and see what I can do and really observe my giving heart to make sure it is learning and in the right place.  I want to fully complete today's study.  

Till tomorrow for part two of the Respect Dare day 6......

Monday, March 18, 2013

Respect Dare Day 5: Me and My Big Mouth


Well, its obvious what today's dare is about and this is definitely one of my weaknesses.  To actually wait and hear everything before "going off" is not easy but I do understand what this lesson was saying. That the other person may need to talk it out and learn from it in God's time before I jump in with a comment that may just start an argument.  The verses above pretty much state how God wants us to be and I had to print it out to remind me that I'm not living the way God wants me to live if I don't do what he has instructed.

I had to look back on my marriage, and actually my life, and I see so many arguments I could have avoided or would have had a more positive outcome if I had listened more and was slower in jumping to conclusions or being caught up in the moment.  I feel like its going to be tough to remain calm in the middle of a storm but I need to start working on it.  A more positive outcome sounds better to me than arguing and being miserable all the time.  Plus I now realize my ideas may not be the best for a specific situation.  

While reading and rereading James 1:19 I'm realizing it takes more to be strong in self control than in reacting.  I have decided I am going to work on my respectful communication in order to reign in my emotional communication.  

Honestly, I started the day really reading this and as the day went on, it faded from my heart.  I'm not sure if Satan is at work or what but it is amazing I'm so ready to do the day's dare and by the end of the day I have so many distractions and things that take my time away.  As I sit here my mind is wandering about other things that are definitely not important.  I'm really needing God's help right now to focus on him.  

I do have to mention that this past Sunday we had that couple over that I had mentioned and I had asked my husband if he could handle Peyton that evening as I had a meeting to attend.  All I heard him say was he would be working in Durham.  What I heard and what he meant were two different things.  I really wanted to blow up right then and there and I held back for some reason.  More than likely it was because our friends were sitting right there, but a part of me wanted to just take it "offline" and talk to him later about it.  Well today I decided to email him how I felt and that I am trying so hard to change within and struggling and his nonchalant attitude about my work was starting to anger me.  His reply was so not what I had expected and it really saddened me because one sentence really brought home the fact, no, I guess I really didn't know him if I thought he meant he wouldn't watch our youngest while I attended a meeting.  We both really need to start communicating more because thank God, He didn't create us with the ability to read each other's minds.  He created us as individuals.  

I hope tomorrow is a better day on focusing on this series.  I may not be able to write tomorrow since it will be a late night for me.  I'll try to post even a small one tomorrow.  

Till then....





Sunday, March 17, 2013

Respect Dare: Day 4 The Vision

Ahh yes I need to remind myself over and over, God already knows where He wants to see me go and what he wants me to do.  I am the one holding myself back I am now realizing.  I just sit and am in awe that God knew and saw me before I was even born.  Sometimes its really hard to grasp that, but it also comforts me knowing he holds me in His arms.

Today's reading and dare is about recognizing God's vision for my life.  That He has a specific purpose in mind for me in glorify him.  This dare I am to write a positive purpose statement in the present tense that reflects 4 months from now, describing who I think God has planned for me to be and how I am to interact primarily in my marriage and family.  WOW is all I can say.  I'm a little overwhelmed by this task and still thinking about what I want to write.  There are so many things I could point out of how I want to see myself in this marriage 4 months from now and then there are things I'm a little embarrassed to have to admit I'm not good at (i.e. daily devotion).  Well....that is why I'm doing this 40 day dare, to become the person God wanted me to be in my marriage and in my daily walk with God.

I've been asking God to show me what he wants me to do in my life.  I am starting to let go of the control I thought I have had in all the decisions I've been making and how I've been living my life.  I'm going to start fully trusting in God and really listening to where he wants me to be and who he wants me to become.  I also know I wont be the same person I am now and I'm perfectly fine with that.  I did share with my husband that I am scared of being "the pastor's wife" as its the unknown that scares me.  I knew his calling was to preach and lead as I met him when he was the associate pastor in Colorado Springs.  So why am I so hesitant in helping and being supportive of what God has called my husband to do?  There are so many "excuses" why I don't, but I'm going to be putting my trust where it belongs, in God first and then my husband.  Randy deserves the support in what he is called to do and I feel its time I push my feelings aside and support him in his calling.  I've even started praying for God to change me instead of changing Randy.  

God, give me the strength to put my selfishness aside and help me to learn to support Randy in his calling in preaching Your word.  Lord, I'm scared of the unknown but I know you will not leave or forsake me.  I need your guidance right now as I struggle through this journey that I am taking to gain a deeper connection with You and with my husband.  Lord, help me to be the Godly wife you created me to be.  In your name, Amen...







Saturday, March 16, 2013

Respect Dare: Day 3 Introspection: Biblical Wife


Well day 3 started off to a rough start.  First I couldnt do the day 3 dare until later in the day since my youngest was up extremely early and fighting the flu (stomach flu with a high fever).  So needless to say I'm exhausted but still going to proceed with day 3 even though I want to throw in the towel and wait another day. 

Today's dare is about assessing our current state using a tool that addresses various aspects of being a biblical wife.  The chapter made it clear that not all marriages are created to be the same.  The Personal Assessment questions fell under four main categories:  Disciple, Household Manager,  Communicator, and Confident and Assured Woman.  I was to answer each one quickly but also prayerfully.  Some of these questions really hit home that I'm not the biblical wife I started out as when I married Randy, and another question really showed that I have slipped in my spiritual walk. Dont get me wrong, my heart belongs to God and I am faithful to Him, its the time management and giving Him my first time etc.  Like I had mentioned yesterday, I used to put work before anything and would stress about being late or missing a day to a sick child (or even me for that matter).  The first two days had already started to change the way I am prioritizing.  Maybe this is why God's been nudging me over quite a few months now and I'm finally giving in to listening to what He has to say.  

The dare today really opened my eyes to so much more.  I have so much work to do on myself and now I realize I have work that needs to be done on me, not everyone around me.  In the communication section, boy, that is my weakest of all.  I thought I was pretty good at communicating, I couldnt be more further off on that thinking.  I need to be quick to listen and slow to speaking.  I have a tendency of really speaking my mind when I should be zipping the lips :-).  There was one question I really was happy to answer though, " Do I ever criticize my husband in public?"  That I can honestly answer no.  We have had our share of disagreements, but there is one thing I cant complain about, he definitely is a great husband.

After all the Personal Assessment questions were answered, I had one more question that made me sit back and have to think about, "What are the two aspects from above that you feel most led to improve upon at this time?"  Gosh, I would have to say one of the answers came from the Disciple category and the other from Household Manager.  Both of these choices really hit me hard as I realized I was more concerned about what other people thought thank how I was living my life for God.  Its so easy to fall in this pit but I'm just thankful God has opened up my eyes.  

As I was about to finish today's blog, I read today's reading in "Jesus Calling" that Aunt Sheila had given me for my birthday.  The topic was pretty accurate for today.  

"It is good that you recognize your weakness.  That keeps you looking to Me, your Strength.  Abundant life is not necessarily health and wealth; it is living in continual dependence on Me.  Instead of trying to fit this day into a preconceived mold, relax and be on the lookout for what I am doing.  This mind-set will free you to enjoy Me and to find what I have planned for you to do.  This is far better than trying to make things go according to your own plan.

Don't take yourself so seriously.  Lighten up and laugh with Me.  You have Me on your side, so what are you worried about?  I can equip you to do absolutely anything, as long as it is My will.  The more difficult your day, the more I yearn to help you.  Anxiety wraps you up in yourself, trapping you in your own thoughts.  When you look to me and whisper My Name, you break free and receive My help.  Focus on Me, and you will find Peace in my My Presence."

Well, off to enjoy some really great company with a couple we have gotten to know.  Till next time......

Friday, March 15, 2013

The Respect Dare: Day 2



Well day 2 of the Respect Dare was about our childhood and how we grow up perceiving what marriage is by what we have observed, how conflicts are resolved, etc. between our parents and couples we know.  Of course my mind started to go in all directions as I do remember my childhood quite well and I have so many wonderful memories, but I sure do remember the conflicts in our house growing up.  

One particular conflict was when I was already in bed and my parents had started to argue.  They had thought my sister and I were already asleep but we weren't and we had heard all the screaming and yelling.  I specifically remember my mom barging into my sister's and my room that night and had grabbed my little suitcase with a lamb on it.  My mom had said she wanted to leave and was taking us.  My dad had walked in and had grabbed the suitcase out of her hand and threw it, which ended up breaking it (it was an old fashioned wood suitcase with a lamb painted on it).  I always had thought from that day that they would end up apart but they are still married to this day.   My parents, that I remember, never fought like that again.  They are like all couples and argue but the way they argue is different.  

I guess I am so used to yelling and words flying when in arguments that I've brought them with me into my marriage.  Randy has got to be the direct opposite of me.  He is calm (in most cases) and knows how to pick his battles. But most of all, he knows how to communicate without the yelling and so very patient with me.  I am learning, and boy some days it is hard to believe he has stuck it out with me.  

On another note, today was difficult to do and really concentrate on because our littlest one came down with the stomach flu.  For the first time since I gave birth to her I was calm about it.  What I mean by that is I always was worked up about it in the past that when she became sick, I would literally stress about how I would handle work.  On this journey, I've also decided to prioritize.  Yes, I know we rely way too heavily on my income and health insurance, but I also know my family needs to start coming second (of course, God is first)....that means work needs to start coming third.  Most know that we never did sell my townhouse that I had bought way before Randy and I were even married.  I'm the type of person that was brought up that you do not walk away from your responsibilities.  I bought that place, and therefore it is my responsibility (not the government or someone elses').  Having that mortgage and the rent here (which is about $1200 each), it really amazes me how we are making all our obligations every month.   God has always provided for our family, especially during the times I wasn't sure where we would get the money for our next rent payment.  He always takes care of our needs and that is something I am still learning to accept.  The saying below is one of my favorite that I hold close to my heart.  Knowing God holds my future is enough for me. 


Thursday, March 14, 2013

The Respect Dare: Day 1

This is my first day at blogging and also at reading The Respect Dare: 40 Days to a Deeper Connection with God and Your Husband written by Nina Roesner.  


Going into day 1 of this journey I was excited but also reluctant as I read that this book will help me look within instead of always looking outward at my husband and always having expectations of him and not showing him (or God) the respect he deserves.  I've already had my eyes opened by just reading the "Why this book was written" chapter and it pretty much nails how most women go into marriage.  There are so many expectations women have of their spouses when they get married.  

This book asked of me to follow a few simple rules:
* that I need to take this one day at a time
* I should have no expectations of my husband's behavior 
* measure my progress in terms of spiritual growth, and do not compare my growth to others spiritual growth.  
* keep a journal (hence, why I've decided to blog, its easier than writing my feelings on paper)
* and to remember that this is a journey, and it pointed out it will not always be a pleasant one.

Pretty easy to follow right?  Well, I thought it sounded pretty easy as all it asked me to write out were three tangible, measurable statements of expectations I have held for my husband under the heading "Expectations of My Husband That I Release". But as I started thinking about the three that I would write, I just started praying that God help me with this as I really didn't want to go into this numb or just going through the motions of finishing this book but not having a deep longing effect on me like I am yearning for it to have.  I really want HIS input and HIS guidance in this journey I had just started as I really want the relationship I once had with God but also the relationship all women want with their husbands.  Needless to say, it took me half the day to write those three expectations down on a piece of paper.  

Next thing it asked me to do is to fold this paper up, put it in a sealed envelope and date it exactly 6 months from todays' day.  I put it in my September day timer slot for me to see 6 months later.  

The verse for today was Psalms 5:3
My voice shalt thou hear in the morning, O LORD; in the morning will I direct my prayer unto thee, and will look up.

and also Proverbs 16:3 Commit to the LORD whatever you do, and your plans will succeed. 


I'm really looking forward to this journey and will continue to pray for the strength and for God to lead me the way He wants me to go. Till then.....